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Alexmf
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PostSubject: 6.37   Sun 10 Sep - 3:23

DotA Allstars v6.37


* Fixed a big exploit with waveform
* Medusa's Purge now deals 600 damage to summoned units, instead of instantly killing them
* Rebalanced Alchemist
* Reduced the Kobold Endurance Aura from 17% ms to 15% ms
* Hand of Midas IAS from 35% to 30%
* Cyclone on creeps from 20 to 10 seconds
* Reduced Primal Roar cooldown and Call of the Wild manacost
* Treads from +60 to +65 ms and from +30% ias to +35%
* Land Mines can now be properly seen on minimap
* WTF mode now requires voting
* Added a better cancel icon for Pulse Nova
* Increased Enchantress's Intelligence per level
* Fixed a bug with -ar and -random that allowed you to get two heroes


www.getdota.com
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Hiruko
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PostSubject: Re: 6.37   Sun 10 Sep - 4:13

Nice. I hope that they really nerfed Alchi this time Razz
But why do they nerf Midas from 35 to 30% if the gold cost is still 1400? Neutral +400 gold cost for +5% IAS is, uh, quite a huge nerf.

Did Ice Frog fail his exams because of an Ovide's text? clown

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Alexmf
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PostSubject: Re: 6.37   Sun 10 Sep - 6:50

Nerfs on Alchemist were quite major, they nerfed BAT improvement from ultimate again, Greed now gives again less gold, and Acid Spray decreases armor by less.

Enchantress int gain = 2.8 now.

Midas nerf was good because it was still strong, PT buff was nice as well because BoT was a lot better on most heroes.

But where are the nerfs for Silencer/Abaddon/Obsidian Destroyer/...the new items...etc :S
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Kills
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PostSubject: Re: 6.37   Sun 10 Sep - 8:25

the +10% with 400 gold added is not the only thing that was changed... also the gold bonus was increased with the new midas, which is not nerfed now. so midas is still worth it.
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Olannon
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PostSubject: Re: 6.37   Sun 10 Sep - 8:53

Overall I'd say that Midas has been changed a lot. It was primarily an IAS item with the added bonus of uber counter for chen, while it is now less of an IAS item (especially with treads...) and more of a 'kill-one-creep-get-gold' item. Now it is best used by farming heroes who can afford the mana every now and then. It should not be viewed as a farming item unless the game will go on for a long long time. It takes a lot of time before midas will be directly worth its cost in terms of gold, and one might argue that treads is better now. I see midas more and more as a counter to helm of the dominator and chen. If you want IAS, go treads or hyper even. It might be worth it on certain heroes (some might scream silencer) but then again wouldn't other items (guinsoo's) be better?

And alex, if you nerf Silencer you must nerf Lich too. At the moment, most of the high-level games are won by Scourge. Someone claimed it to be as much as 70% against evenly matched clans. So, if you nerf Silencer even more (god that movespeed nerf sucked) you have to nerf Lich, Visage, Viper and a few more scourge heroes, too. On the contrary, the indirect rangedhero nerf (deny = some xp) nerfed silencer to such a degree, a lot of players now argue he's not invaluable to a team anymore. Obsidian needs no nerf, too weak early game and can be perma-disabled later on (at least if the Sent's pick wisely). He is often tiems matched by a Dps hero with strong lanecontrol early game (read: venge for example) and will be rather shitty when entering midgame. Besides, most scourge team's are oriented around either AoE ulti's or midgame pushing now a days, and Harbinger has none of the abilities you'd want there. As such, even though certain aspects of him might seem IMBA, his failure to synergize well with other scourge tactics renders him 'not-IMBA'.

Abaddon, on the other hand, needs a small nerf I believe. Reason: Too versatile.. If you see a Viper, you will think DPS hero. If you see SK, you will think AoE. If you see Razor, you will think farmer/dps. If you see Abaddon, you don't know whether you'll be facing a farmer, tanker, supporter, killer, chaser or pusher. He is too versatile at the moment, making him fit in everywhere. Oh, and duplicate shields in -DU mode is imba Razz

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Alexmf
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PostSubject: Re: 6.37   Sun 10 Sep - 10:29

Quote :
Overall I'd say that Midas has been changed a lot. It was primarily an IAS item with the added bonus of uber counter for chen, while it is now less of an IAS item (especially with treads...) and more of a 'kill-one-creep-get-gold' item. Now it is best used by farming heroes who can afford the mana every now and then. It should not be viewed as a farming item unless the game will go on for a long long time. It takes a lot of time before midas will be directly worth its cost in terms of gold, and one might argue that treads is better now. I see midas more and more as a counter to helm of the dominator and chen. If you want IAS, go treads or hyper even. It might be worth it on certain heroes (some might scream silencer) but then again wouldn't other items (guinsoo's) be better?

It's a counter for Chen/HotD, but still a very good item for any hero that fits into these categories:

>enough mana
>needs ias
>doesn't have to rush a certain item (like SK/dagger or sth like that)

It is not as effective as in 6.36b anymore, but still worth buying on a lot of heroes because the money is gotten back quite quickly (transmuting a centaur or sth like that gives almost 250 gold) and you have the option to go BoT instead of Treads (of course, if your hero needs exceptionally much IAS, you can obtain both). Some typical Midas-Heroes on which it is still worth buying are: Silencer, Sniper, Bone, Troll, Visage, Medusa, Drow, Furion, Destroyer.

Quote :
And alex, if you nerf Silencer you must nerf Lich too. At the moment, most of the high-level games are won by Scourge. Someone claimed it to be as much as 70% against evenly matched clans. So, if you nerf Silencer even more (god that movespeed nerf sucked) you have to nerf Lich, Visage, Viper and a few more scourge heroes, too. On the contrary, the indirect rangedhero nerf (deny = some xp) nerfed silencer to such a degree, a lot of players now argue he's not invaluable to a team anymore.

True, Lich/Viper/Visage and some other heroes still need nerfs as well. But Silencer is still too strong, global silence can easily win teambattles, and Silencer's dps is still very high (glaives dmg is not reduced by anything).

Quote :
Obsidian needs no nerf, too weak early game and can be perma-disabled later on (at least if the Sent's pick wisely). He is often tiems matched by a Dps hero with strong lanecontrol early game (read: venge for example) and will be rather shitty when entering midgame. Besides, most scourge team's are oriented around either AoE ulti's or midgame pushing now a days, and Harbinger has none of the abilities you'd want there. As such, even though certain aspects of him might seem IMBA, his failure to synergize well with other scourge tactics renders him 'not-IMBA'.

Lategame, Destroyer with 2*Soulbooster, Treads and 2*Hyperstone will have INSANE dps. Arcane Orb isn't reduced by anything, and it's crazy - lategame you can have +200 damage from Arcane Orb alone which is comparable to almost 2 Divine Rapiers. He also has a disable and he does have an AoE ulti, unlike you said. Believe me, Destroyer's dps lategame is easily > Bone's/Razor's/Silencer's/whoevers. See diaz_leon's Destroyer guide at dotaportal.com (he already shows that OD is imba but he has been buffed since that).
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Hiruko
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PostSubject: Re: 6.37   Sun 10 Sep - 14:11

Kills wrote:
the +10% with 400 gold added is not the only thing that was changed... also the gold bonus was increased with the new midas, which is not nerfed now. so midas is still worth it.

Till around 6.32b it was 1000 gold for +25%ias. It got some changes and now we have 1400 gold for +30% ias. 5%ias is almost nothing. As you said bonus gold was increased, so it sure is still worth, but it is quite nerfed since 400 gold is a lot early game ^_^

ps. & Power treads is still useless on every hero below 315 base ms. Neutral

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PostSubject: Re: 6.37   Tue 12 Sep - 14:49

They should nerf Bone Fletcher coz he's imba in late game ; o
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PostSubject: Re: 6.37   Mon 2 Oct - 16:24

I want to have a abbadon nerf for his shield.

They need to fix the range of it, smart players can kick your ass in early- till midgame with it..it makes me cry Sad
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Olannon
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PostSubject: Re: 6.37   Mon 2 Oct - 23:52

Did you ever try morph vs abaddon early game? While waveforming he simply avoids the shield breaking, making him an excellent counter. Hurt him a little and waveform. This will break his shield and hurt him, leaving you pretty much the way you were before starting the waveform Wink

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PostSubject: Re: 6.37   Tue 3 Oct - 4:08

hm i think imbaddon alone shouldnt be a problem... the prob is imbaddon+pugna O_O morph+? to counter?
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PostSubject: Re: 6.37   Tue 3 Oct - 7:01

Well morph to counter the shield, and then some nice disabler like rhasta to kick the hell out of him Smile
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